“You liberals just want free stuff” says the party whose president just accepted a free 300 million dollar airplane.
he goes on to say, he gets welfare in his little rant later on.
I don’t want free healthcare, I want the healthcare I pay for with hundreds of my hard earned dollars every month.
I’m not a saint, I can be pretty selfish in my reasons for treating people well.
I just want everyone taken care of because I want to live in a society that takes care of all the people. I want good education because I want to be around well educated people. I want healthcare for everyone because I want to be around active healthy people who live to old age. I want limits and regulations for companies because I want clean air and safe products.
It’s not fucking rocket science.
I moved out of the USA about 10 years ago. There are many reasons, both big and small. When people ask why, I’ve learned to boil it down to one overarching idea: I believe we should live in a society where the people are primarily treated as the definition of the society and not where the people are primarily treated as a resource belonging to the society.
Well said
Also, if society was fully comprised of well cared for and well educated people, wars and crimes would be an almost non-existent occurrence. Meaning, I’d be able to go to sleep every night without expecting to be woken up by an air raid warning.
Pretty selfish of me, I know /s
A happy community is a safe community.
he also said he hates charity but wants hand outs from time to time.
Thunderdome for the rich.
Two billionaires enter, zero billionaires leave.
They’re still alive but we took all their money and divided it amongst the crowd.
I say let them fight to the death. Winner takes all.
Two billionaires enter, one trillionaire leaves?
Then a new billionaire will challenge the trillionaire for their wealth. These greedy fucks will do anything to make their imaginary numbers go higher.
Had me in the first half
I once told someone: “look, when I step outside, I don’t want to see homeless people. That is why I happily pay my taxes and am supportive of social safety nets.”
I have different reasons like human rights but in that conversation, a selfish perspective was the better way to make the point.
Oh that’s a good one. Mind if I steal it for future use?
Sure. I strongly support the usage of selfish leftish reasonings.
Another good one is “look, I don’t want me shit stolen, poor people steal my shit. less poor people, less shit of mine is stolen. That is why I support a social safety net”
Obviously in reality, the rich steal more of my shit but that is the next left wing reason of taxation.
Edit: for free education, there are also some good ones. Free education => more accessibility => more e.g. doctors, cheaper quicker healthcare. More doctors => more competition => better doctors and better service.
There’s a reason we talk about collective self interest. There’s no point in organizing human societies otherwise.
OMG I love you! Do you take requests? I’d love one for environmentalism or proper healthcare. Then I’ll stop nagging you
Environmentalism is difficult because it just doesn’t work for certain things. CO2 is for a big part of the population not a real issue. Like they die anyway soonish. If you talk about clean beaches and parks, It could work but that is probably not your focus.
Proper healthcare as in ‘free’? Or just a better quality? Anti-corpo health insurance?
I would love to think about arguments like that but I need details to form them.
Thanks mate. Common thing I come up against with healthcare is “it’s socialised medicine! It’s badly run and a waste of money”. I’ve never managed to successfully argue against that.
Well, the more intellectual solid argument would be the argument of normalized price. Just like in anything in capitalism, the price of stuff changes. By e.g. investing a little into a stock every Monday, no matter what, you normalize the cost of your stocks. On a large enough time scale, you will have paid the average price of the stock over the timeframe. So you “never” bought the peak, and… Well the dip… But it give you a reasonable security, if you have to sell you don’t lose much under most situations. and well, you don’t win much. If we see healthcare under the same light, we can conclude that a tax (a regular investment independent of market conditions) into the healthcare system, would normalize your cost of healthcare. So in the case, you need healthcare, you don’t lose or win much compared to your normalized price. While otherwise you might buy the dip or the peak. Obviously the counterargument would be that it is only true of the health is average. If you are above average healthy, you would statistically speaking pay more. Counterargument of the counterargument is of course that e.g. cancer can fuck anyone at any time. So averaging your risk might be a good choice. Obviously private health insurance are normalizing cost too but most “customers” better normalization and a broader distribution of administrative costs. Think of it like big corporation replacing small family business by being cheaper through broader distribution of costs.
I think that is a bit complex for the previous style.
So the better short argument would be about distribution of costs. In a “if you live alone, you need to cook, if you live with your partner, only 1 person needs to cook” way. But I need more time.
Oooooh nice! Thanks so much for this, it’s really helpful ☺️
There are lots of arguments in favor of environmental protections even if someone thinks CO2 is not an issue. Think smog over major cities, or rivers being too polluted to swim in, or oil spills. You can’t eat the fish you catch in many water bodies because of industrial contamination with heavy metals and PCBs. Mine tailings leach chemicals out into lakes and rivers. This is all very visible stuff that cannot be waved away with vague doubts.
You can counter the “drill baby drill” people by pointing out that using up our oil first makes us dependent on other countries in the future. Given that the world has a finite supply of oil, it’s smart to keep ours in the ground as much as possible. Hold on to that domestic oil as a future “strategic reserve,” and focus on developing renewables for our daily energy needs.
I agree with you but you seem to misunderstand me. I tried to express that for a lot of people the CO2 issue is the one that they really want to focus on, due to the impact. The arguments for reducing CO2 are almost entirely long term issues and a lot of people think they won’t experience it anyway as they die beforehand, making a selfish argument difficult. Especially if they are supposed to be simple punchline.
For non-co2 issues, it is easy.
I like to take a national defense stance for healthcare, and it deffo catches people flat-footed.
Providing healthcare to the citizens is how we keep our population healthy enough to repel an invasion. There’s that famous apocryphal quote about how the Japanese didn’t invade in WWII because we have a gun behind every blade of grass and they were afraid of our fighting spirit. These days, the rest of the world sees us as fat and lazy, so we’re making ourselves into sitting ducks by refusing public-option healthcare. We couldn’t do a draft now, we’re too unhealthy.
What “free stuff?” You mean the things I PAY TAXES for?
It’s also not free. I am paying for these things. These are the things I want my tax money going towards. I’m not asking for free handouts, I’m asking for smart and workable application of my taxes for the betterment of society.
that sounds an awful lot like communism, and we can’t have that /s
Who doesn’t like free stuff?
Weirdos
I pay taxes for the things I want
But free stuff is cool too
In contrast, we far leftists want free stuff.
Basically, we want to be able to tune the production process of essentials so that potatoes 🥔 and drinking water 🥤are dispensed the way we do napkins, and people can take all they need. And with time we expand the free stuff dispensed to smart phones and rocket fuel and ice cream sundaes 🍨
The stuff isn’t absolutely free, and even these days napkin dispensers are adorned with save the trees signs but the price to the end-user is negligible. Sometimes we have to watch our systems for abuse, but then sometimes someone just needs a lot of potatoes. 🥔
Also tool libraries and eventually motor pools that can serve communities who sometimes need gear, but not always. It’s kinda creepy how big automotive has us buying two cars for every home and we can’t spare government funds for (eventually free) robust public rail.
The 2020 lockdown showed us that people are not turned into couch potatoes 🥔 by benefits and furloughs. (They do couch potato after burnout or due to depression) rather they take up hobbies, many of which become lucrative or are useful to the community. (Community projects were harder because we were hiding in our homes) This led to the Great Resignation during which companies had to offer higher than minimum wage for their bottom-rung jobs.
We’ve also seen government benefits programs facilitate great movements in art. The whole British Rock-&-Roll boom of the 1960s followed the post-war restoration programs to get everyone who lost everything fed again and back into homes. Then someone threw in an electric guitar.
So it’s not bad to want free stuff. It’s just assumed that you can’t have free stuff if someone else can make a profit by charging, ergo paid toilets and office bathroom tissue pools.
They’ll read this while not understanding empathy and think you’re faking being a good person
Classic “without religion, people would rape all they want” energy. We’re being dragged down by a vocal subset of humans that are literally broken in their brains.
IMHO it’s a mental illness. “Without religion, people would rape all they want” is a great quote, because most of these people are projecting. They actually would go around raping all they wanted (and with great enthusiasm) if there wasn’t some authority to prevent them, because that’s who they are. They cannot comprehend people who voluntarily wouldn’t rape people even when they could, because they can’t put themselves into the head of other people.
It’s ezpz for me. Without religion I’ll just kill myself. I’ve been comfortable not existing before I was born, I guess I just don’t exist and be fine ya know? But it’s that darn karma, I don’t want to fuck up my reincarnation cycle and be born again as a worm inside Trump’s intestine ya know?
I don’t understand how they can focus on LIBERALS wanting free stuff, while totally ignoring that all Republicans/MAGAs want are more tax breaks and loopholes.
If we’re going to give the money away anyway, I’d rather give it to people who need it, than people who already have more than they, or their descendants, will ever need.
Conservatives: “Liberals just want free stuff”
Also Conservatives: “Hello, police, there’s an immigrant/black/brown person and I don’t like it”
🧐
Everyone got “free stuff” from 0-18ish. Should your parents have itemized everything and given you a bill of $377,567 when you moved out? Started payment plans? The argument here is actually “I don’t want anyone but me getting free stuff and help”.
No, no. See, when your parents are infirm, they depend on your support. It’s a system of mutual aid, from those able to provide it, to those who need it, totally different from any of that leftist bunk.
I want to fucking get what I’m paying taxes FOR. Which is not yet another war crime. US healthcare has us at the worst quality of life, the lowest life expectancy, and the HIGHEST cost out of any developed nation. It’s fucking ridiculous. “Uh huh buh where u gonna get the money for hea-” “FROM MY FUCKING TAXES YOU ILLITERATE FUCK” God damn I’m so incensed from having this conversation so often with dumb assholes who don’t realize how dumb they are.
fun fact: the USA pays about $14K per capita for healthcare, and the rest of the developed world pays between $3K-6K for universal healthcare. The yankees would pay LESS for universal healthcare.
You guys need to get over this notion that we are civilized.
